I love this passage. 57 (trans. Vridar: Musings on biblical studies, politics, religion, ethics, human nature, tidbits from science (http://vridar.org/) by Neil Godfrey", -- Klaas Spronk, - Bibliotheca Orientalis LXXI, 3/4 (2014). Often enough punishments that in some way mimicked the crime were imposed. Bowersock, somewhat chagrined, admits to being taken aback by Shaws carefully reasoned case that such an established tradition could suddenly be undercut, revealing cracks in an edifice we thought we knew well.. Tacitus and Suetonius speak elsewhere of the Jews as representinga pernicious religion, of expulsions of Jews from Rome, of corrupt practices coming from the east, including Judea. For Aegyptus, these fifty marriages appeared as an easy route to acquire the properties of Danaus. For all we know from the available evidence Peter died in the 50s, in Jerusalem, peacefully in his sleep. When the sons found out who their mother was, they put Dirce to death by bidning her to an untamed bull; by the kindness of Liber [Dionysos], whose votary she was, on Mount Cithaeron, a spring was formed from her body, which was called Dirce. I like Hurtados works on Christology, but at the same time I have to be alert to the fact that he has conveniently found arguments that support his personal Christian beliefs so one does need to read his critics at the same time. Required fields are marked *. Yet not only do Christian commentators not breathe a word of such a myth (and that includes prime martyrologists like Tertullian and the historian Eusebius) until the beginning of the 400s, some of their documents actually say things which make it impossible that they could have been aware of or subscribed to such a myth, as in the Acts of Paul, and the Acts of Peter. "There is a river called Dirke (Dirce) [near Thebes] after the wife of Lykos (Lycus). My books, and those I have published for others, consistently maintain 4-star and better ratings despite the occasional 1- and 2-star ratings from people angry about my kicking over sacred cows. unholy insults as Danaids and Dircae, safely reached the goal in the race of faith, and received a noble reward, feeble though they were in body. It would take a separate article to cover the evidence for this word not being generally known among the elites of the likes of Tacitus, Juvenal, Pliny and Suetonius until the early second century. Under Martin V he reached the top rank of his office, as Apostolicus Secretarius, papal secretary. I reserve all rights, but I give permission to use this page in Bible studies or other FREE ways. At first those who confessed were taken away for punishment; subsequently others who were denounced by others were rounded up. This first letter of Clement (a second letter was falsely attributed to him) was copied by the Corinthian Church and circulated all over the empire, rendering the very first papal encyclical. It was so highly regarded by the universal church that for several centuries the Church in Egypt and elsewhere regarded it as one of the New Testament scriptures. "Antiopa, daughter of Nycteus . Ancient history is obviously less verifiable than recent history, and open to speculative revisions of various sorts, including the use of some presumed legends and forgeries against others, according to taste. 3) 1 Clement is authentic therefore confirms the Pauls death under Nero. : Pausanias, Description of Greece 9. The paucity and weakness of the data, however, have not prevented acceptance of the historicity of this first persecution as an undisputed fact. In a footnote Holmes explains the reference to Danaids and Dircae: "[I]n ancient mythology the daughters of Danaus were given as prizes to the winners of a race; thus it is likely that this is a reference to Christian women being raped prior to being martyred. The people of Argos took this as a sign and chose Danaus as their king. 5. Do not hesitate to ask the community! Similar terminology is used in the New Testament. In his review of books relating to Roman history, Inside the Emperors Clothes (Dec. 17), G. W. Bowersock makes mention of the recent article by Prof. Brent Shaw (The Myth of the Neronian Persecution) who calls into question the historical actuality of the tradition presented by Tacitus about a vast and cruel slaughter of Christians by the emperor Nero, accused of being responsible for the Great Fire in Rome in 64 CE. The forty-nine brides who killed their husband were punished for their crime. For how could Christians not have known and embraced such a prime example of their experiences of martyrdom, given their intense focus and fascination on their sufferings for the faith? They were to marry the 50 sons of Danaus' twin brother Aegyptus, a mythical king of Egypt. A complete bibliography of the translations quoted on this page. I find the point 2 particularly biased and apologetical: impliciter, he is winking at those who say that the Romans coined the term Christian because they were historicists: the Christians were followers of a historical human leader. Because the water was always leaking, they would forever try to fill the tub. This video claims that the Christians took blame for the fire themselves (whether they did or not). Peter, through unrighteous envy, endured not one or two, but numerous labors and when he had at length suffered martyrdom, departed to the place of glory due to him. This post is going straight to the March 2016 Biblical Studies Carnival. Owing to envy, Paul also obtained the reward of patient endurance, after being seven times thrown into captivity, compelled to flee, and stoned. 5 (trans. I think I was the first to present a comprehensive case (587-630) for the whole Neronian persecution as a consequence of the Great Fire, let alone the idea of any Christian responsibility for it, as being a later myth. In Jewish apocalyptic mythology Nero was depicted as a bestial figure, no doubt because the war that ended with the destruction of the Temple was commenced under his reign. I am going to agree with added later because the Danaids are women from Greek mythology. He also presented a circus entertainment and in the dress of a charioteer he either mixed with the crowd or stood in his own chariot. Enter the email address you signed up with and we'll email you a reset link. Its the prohibition against knowing, Interestingly, 80% of Israeli Christians say that the Israeli government is insincere in pursuing peace (against 72% of Israeli Muslims)., You can also remember Ladon guarding the garden of the Hesperides https://www.theoi.com/Titan/Hesperides.html, Hi Diana and everyone else. 10 ff (trans. Nonetheless, the Bible reports him as a "preacher of righteousness" (2 Pet. 5 (trans. They first made a stop in Rhodes, where they founded Lindos town and built a temple to goddess Athena Lindia. Here is Shaws translation of the passage, beginning at the beginning: A disaster followed. Thus was he removed from the world. "[The rivers and springs flee before the pregnant goddess Leto, fearing the wrath of Hera should they provide her refuge :] Fled, too, Aonia [Boiotia] on the same course, and [the Naiades] Dirke (Dirce) and Strophia, holding the hands of their sire, dark-pebbled Ismenos (Ismenus). Please carry on. Five Reasons Why Mythicism is Disappointing, Where Morality Comes From a Rawlsian view, As for Near Death Experiences, I ask myself what is more likely: that a person really did in some sense, There are tonnes of things in the ot that draw from ancient near East beliefs, further Myth made fact a, Dear Austendw, Darshans essay is fascinating, and shows in my opinion how much Leviticus sacrificial and purity laws are at, Hi Neil As you may remember, I have not in the past been a fan of Russell Gmirkins theory that, I wish there was an edit button: These bittersweet messages seem, to me, to be more of a sigh of, The problem of course is that the serpents advice is perfectly reasonable and indeed wise. The trope of the jealous spouse delating his wife to Roman authorities inthe city of Rome is also found in the writings of Justin Martyr who was probably writing in the mid-second century. 57 (trans. Ec., II, 25. His treatment, although unnecessarily prolix, argues quite powerfully against the widespread conviction that Chrestus is Christ. The few remnants of houses in the other seven were reduced to stripped and half-burned ruins. (p. 231), Allen, N.P.L. I will gloss over the details of Shawsarguments for the above and move on to the account by the Roman historian Tacitus of Neros persecution of the Christians in the wake of the Great Fire ofRome in 64 C.E. . The third is the special interest of the Roman Church in the death of the two chief apostles, Peter and Paul, at Rome. After preaching both in the east and west, he gained the illustrious reputation due to his faith, having taught righteousness to the whole world, and come to the extreme limit of the west, and suffered martyrdom under the prefects. Rather, the punishments Suetonius speaks of may well have been one of the occasional banishments from Rome that Jews experienced. (A white Muslim convert I knew well in Norwich once said to me, We dont make your distinction between fact and fiction!). The result is a few phrases in a single passage testifying to the Neronian persecution of Christians because of the fire of Rome and it is constructed fromanachronisms. Document Details : Title: 'Danades et Dircs' Subtitle: Sur 1 Cl 6,2 Author(s): KOZLOWSKI, Jan M. Journal: Ephemerides Theologicae Lovanienses Volume: 82 Issue: 4 Date: December 2006 Pages: 467-478 DOI: 10.2143/ETL.82.4.2018923 Abstract : The purpose of the current article is to address a question to which scholars devoted considerable thought: the identity of the Christian women whom . . when he had completed his Histories. ", "Vridar is consistently thought-provoking, well-informed, and asking the right questions. Having no other option, he consented for the wedding and organized a low-profile wedding party. ISMENOS (Callimachus Hymn to Delos, Nonnus Dionysiaca 44.10), Pseudo-Apollodorus, Bibliotheca 3. This great massacre was unbelievable, even for the bloody ancient Greek myths. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. However, Shaw stresses the importance of recognising the passage is the only source for the involvement of Christians with the fire and their persecution in its aftermath.. Through envy, those women, the Danaids 32 and Dirc, being persecuted . Abstract The purpose of the current article is to address a question to which scholars devoted considerable thought: the identity of the Christian women whom Clement of Rome called Danads and Dircae in his First Epistle to the Corinthians. Overlooked or downplayed in the longstanding debate over the Tacitus passage has been the stark fact that no Christian commentator for over three centuries ever refers to a general anti-Christian pogrom by Nero (beyond the legendary executions of Peter and Paul, which are never linked to the fire). Theoi Project Copyright 2000 - 2017 Aaron J. Atsma, Netherlands & New Zealand, (Callimachus Hymn to Delos, Nonnus Dionysiaca 44.10). Nevertheless, it is evident that this catalogue has almost nothing in common with that of Pseudo-Apollodorus. Yet a man in Plinys position could not have failed to have known that Christians had been condemned to death by torture had such an event really happened. The vague charges of incendiarism assumed a more definite form, and were associated with the character of Antichrist, which the Church was accustomed to ascribe to Nero on account of his supposed diabolical cruelty. The problems here are almost overwhelming. Books and publications are covered with a range of perspectives with attempts at fair and accurate representation of others arguments and content (where there are occasional and inevitable missteps on that I notice Neil making corrections and apologies where warranted, which wins points with me). Dirke was probably the same as the nymphe Derketis. . Anyone interested in becoming a professional umpire and becoming eligible to work in the minor leagues must attend one of the two umpire schools sanctioned by Major League Baseball. He certainly knew of the Great Fire. He made a secret plan to get rid of Aegyptus and his sons for good. 2:5). 6:2 By reason of jealousy women being persecuted, after that they had suffered cruel and unholy insults as Danaids and Dircae, safely reached the goal in the race of faith, and received a noble reward, feeble though they were in body. You may copy, but not sell this information. Online version at the Perseus Digital Library. My own take on how the myth later developed, to appear full-blown in the writings of Sulpicius Severus, sees it as a combination of both Roman and Christian thinking in regard to the Fire and the blame the Christians tendency. Its always gratifying when a reader zeroes in on exactly those aspects I thought were most interesting and most central to my argument. ", "Fantastic. It seems as if official science is here again, as in so many other cases, under the dominion of a long-continued suggestion, in taking the narrative of Tacitus to be genuine without further examination. 6:14). I think, though, that Clement is simply saying that battle for holiness and a pure church is a battle every church must continue in. As such, he functioned as a personal attendant (amanuensis) of the Pope, writing letters at his behest and dictation, with no formal registration of the briefs, but merely preserving copies., https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poggio_Bracciolini. There is every good reason for historians to have grave doubts about the story of an attack on Christians by Nero that emerged decades after the fire itself.They should be sceptical to the point of dismissing the commonly accepted idea of Nero as a persecutor, indeed the first great persecutor of Christians, specifically in connection with the conflagration that raged through Rome in July of 64. Dionysos afterwards transformed her into the spring for she had been a devoted follower of the god. In the classical tradition, they came to represent the futility of a repetitive task that can never be completed (see also Sisyphus and Ocnus). - Letter to the Corinthians, ch. The myth of Danaides is the story of fifty women who commit a horrible wrongdoing: guided by their father, they all kill their husbands on their wedding night! ", "I find your blog most interesting and appreciate your ongoing effort to keep to the evidence for the issues discussed! We use cookies to offer you a better browsing experience and to analyze site traffic. of an individual, and merge them with the art or ideas that belong to the childhood of a people. The first part of the article explores the context in which these designations appear. The trope of the jealous spouse delating his wife to Roman authorities in the city of Rome is also found in the writings of Justin Martyr who was probably writing in the mid-second century. Candida Moss has established the Christian penchant for claiming imaginary persecutions and per the Great Fire of Rome 64 CE and persecution of Christians, the thinness of the evidence on all aspects of it is quite striking (Shaw, 2015). . Lactantius wrote accounts of the wrongful persecutions of Christians by Roman rulers yet he omits any mention of a fire in the time of Nero. Therefore, unless one simply presumes, in a complete void of supporting data, that the words in the pseudo-Clement must have some relationship to the fire in 64 C.E., there is nothing in the text that would lead any reasonably critical reader to connect the two events. And given that the penalties imposed upon these Christians in the days of Nero were associated with a mishmash of other legal restrictions and not with the Fire, wecan accept that Suetonius knew nothing of Christians being singled out for dire punishment because of the Fire. | About Us At this point Tacitus introduces the episode about the Christians. available online @ http://dspace.nwu.ac.za/handle/10394/14213, Your email address will not be published. Lynceus, the only survivor of the fifty sons of Aegyptus, later killed Danaus to revenge for his brothers. This oversight has been corrected. All Rights Reserved. He then returns to the events of Neros time. Further, Tacituss friend Pliny also described Christians in the same terms (the same words), seeing them as a plague spreading throughout the countryside of his province. On account of jealousy women, when they had been persecuted as Danaids and Dircae, and had suffered cruel and unholy insults, safely reached the goal in the race of faith and received a noble reward, feeble though they were in body. Danaus built a ship with fifty oars and fled to Greece with his fifty daughters. Around the turn of the century, then, an identifiable group, disruptive to the social order and known as Christians, were coming to the notice of the ruling classes. Quoted on this page Hymn to Delos, Nonnus Dionysiaca 44.10 ), Pseudo-Apollodorus Bibliotheca. Nevertheless, it is evident that this catalogue has almost nothing in common with that Pseudo-Apollodorus! Is Christ leaking, they would forever try to fill the tub a mythical king of Egypt for ;... Your email address will not be published permission to use this page mythical of. Lynceus, the Bible reports him as a sign and chose Danaus as their king this massacre... Who killed their husband were punished for their crime 32 and Dirc, being persecuted well-informed. Of the article explores the context in which these designations appear probably the same as the nymphe.. Those who confessed were taken away for punishment ; subsequently others who denounced... Bibliography of the passage, beginning at the beginning: a disaster followed catalogue has almost nothing in common that! Well have been one of the translations quoted on this page central my! These designations appear took this as a `` preacher of righteousness '' 2. Of righteousness '' ( 2 Pet in Jerusalem, peacefully in his sleep, `` Vridar is consistently thought-provoking well-informed! Right questions plan to get rid of Aegyptus and his sons for good after the wife of Lykos ( ). 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Thought were most interesting and most central to my argument Danaus to revenge for his brothers of! Time I comment river called Dirke ( Dirce ) [ near Thebes ] after the wife of (! ( Lycus ), the only survivor of the god taken away for punishment subsequently!, `` Vridar is consistently thought-provoking, well-informed, and merge them with the art or that... Translations quoted on this page in Bible studies or other FREE ways ( whether did... The god the 50s, in Jerusalem, peacefully in his sleep good. Biblical studies Carnival had been a devoted follower of the translations quoted on this.. He consented for the bloody ancient Greek myths sons for good near Thebes ] after wife. 44.10 ), Pseudo-Apollodorus, Bibliotheca 3 where they founded Lindos town and built a temple to goddess Athena.. Fifty daughters reduced danaids and dircae stripped and half-burned ruins available online @ http //dspace.nwu.ac.za/handle/10394/14213... Reports him as a `` preacher of righteousness '' ( 2 Pet preacher of righteousness (... Being persecuted righteousness '' ( 2 Pet reserve all rights, but not sell information! Not be published, it is evident that this catalogue has almost nothing in common that...
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